Over the last few years, I’ve heard liberals compare Conservatives and Republicans to Fascists and Hitler. I’ve seen the argument that Fascism is the extreme right-wing, while Socialism or Communism is the extreme left-wing. While this had been said, I’ve never seen one liberal/progressive actually define the system of government for which they decided that Conservatives began to. Well… I’ve had enough, so I’m going to help them out a little bit.
While debating, I’ve had to define these systems of government to liberals, because they clearly do not know what they are. So, for those who know me (or those who don’t), I’ve taken the liberty to list these governments below, along with their definitions:
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Socialism (so·cial·ism) –noun
1. a theory or system of social organization that advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means of production and distribution, of capital,… land, etc., in the community as a whole.
2. procedure or practice in accordance with this theory.
3. (in Marxist theory) the stage following capitalism in the transition of a society to communism, characterized by the imperfect implementation of collectivist principles.
Communism (com·mu·nism) –noun
1. a theory or system of social organization based on the holding of all property in common, actual ownership being ascribed to the community as a whole or to the state.
2. (often initial capital letter) a system of social organization in which all economic and social activity is controlled by a totalitarian state dominated by a single and self-perpetuating political party.
3. (initial capital letter) the principles and practices of the Communist party.
Fascism (fas·cism) –noun
1. (sometimes initial capital letter) a governmental system led by a dictator having complete power, forcibly suppressing opposition and criticism, regimenting all industry, commerce, etc., and emphasizing an aggressive nationalism and often racism.
2. (sometimes initial capital letter) the philosophy, principles, or methods of fascism.
3. (initial capital letter) a fascist movement, especially the one established by Mussolini in Italy 1922–43.
Nazism (Na·zism) –noun
– the principles or methods of the Nazis.
NAZI (Na·zi) –noun
1. a member of the National Socialist German Workers’ party of Germany, which in 1933, under Adolf Hitler, seized political control of the country, suppressing all opposition and establishing a dictatorship over all cultural, economic, and political activities of the people, and promulgated belief in the supremacy of Hitler as Führer, aggressive anti-Semitism, the natural supremacy of the German people, and the establishment of Germany by superior force as a dominant world power. The party was officially abolished in 1945 at the conclusion of World War II.
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My argument has been that the four systems above are relative to each other. They all share similarities, and certain systems lead to the more extreme of the other, such as Socialism leading to Communism, or Socialism leading to Fascism/Naziism.
The liberal argument has historically been that since NAZIs were big Nationalists, and apparently since Conservatives have love for America (their nation), then clearly there’s a direct correlation between the two schools of thought.
Let’s define Nationalism:
Nationalism (na·tion·al·ism) –noun
1. national spirit or aspirations.
2. devotion and loyalty to one’s own nation; patriotism.
3. excessive patriotism; chauvinism.
4. the desire for national advancement or independence.
5. the policy or doctrine of asserting the interests of one’s own nation, viewed as separate from the interests of other nations or the common interests of all nations.
6. an idiom or trait peculiar to a nation.
7. a movement, as in the arts, based upon the folk idioms, history, aspirations, etc., of a nation.
I would ask… what’s so wrong with that? I personally think that America is the last best hope for this world. We offer the greatest opportunity to any citizen or legal immigrant who would choose to take advantage of such opportunities. We have succeeded, tremendously, where others have faltered, and we’ve proven to be the most prosperous society this world has ever seen. Our GDP, in comparison to the 2nd best GDP in the world, should be testament to that. The inventions, innovations and accomplishments that this free country, which utilizes a free-market, capitalistic system should warrant praises from any other country. In addition to this, we also have one of the greatest militaries the world has ever seen. While extremely powerful, also good-natured and voluntary.
Clearly, Liberals are referencing definition #5 and possibly #3… I can only assume that they’re suggesting that Conservatives yearn for a yesteryear, where everyone was the same: same skin color, same religion, same ethnicity, same political ideals, same freedoms, etc.
Unfortunately for Liberals, that time and place has never existed, and even if it had, they couldn’t be more wrong.
As far as Nationalism goes, in regards to NAZIism and their claim of the “extreme right,” they’ll have to demonstrate how anyone on the far right has ever instituted or fought for Nationalist policies, such as Hitler’s. No one on the right has ever setup/used internment camps… that would be their Liberal heroes Woodrow Wilson and Franklin D. Roosevelt, during WWI & WWII. Wilson arrested & imprisoned Irish & German Americans, as well as many from Eastern Europe. FDR arrested and imprisoned Japanese, Italian and German Americans.
Woodrow Wilson segregated the army and believed in and actively supported eugenics. Margaret Sanger, another liberal hero, also partook in actively supporting eugenics, by starting Planned Parenthood, in order to downsize the African American population.
Sound familiar? Hitler was big on Nationalism, as well… and the master German race.
Another argument I’ve seen of late, is that Scott Walker is just like Hitler, because he wants to “break the Unions.” Funny thing is, Hitler was a big union guy. He was very much in favor of unions and thought quite highly of them… So again, these clueless mocking birds are dead wrong. Liberals seem to be selective, when it comes to what they take/learn from history. http://tinyurl.com/6fuy637 (To get you started, should you want to research this issue, yourself.)
I assume this is the fault of their professors at whatever University they might be (or had been) attending. They do have a liberal/progressive agenda in brainwashing their students with propaganda.
Conservatives, historically, have been for the limiting of government and its’ power. Smaller government ALWAYS leads to greater freedom, and this has been our argument for ages. When you look at the above definitions for government systems, what do they suggest? Bigger, overbearing, overreaching, and much more powerful government… Leaving what? Less powerful, less free citizens/slaves.
Liberals fight for more government regulations, oversight, security, restrictions, control, social welfare, handouts, bans, etc. What does this lead to? More expansive government… Socialism, Communism, Fascism, Totalitarianism, etc. Far from the Republic for which we stand and Capitalism – both freedom enhancing systems and two things that Conservatives fight for.
Liberals tend to argue that Conservatives are against individual freedom, in reference to what people do with their body… aka Conservatives are typically pro-life. Well, under the “Life, liberty & pursuit of happiness” precedent, stated in the Declaration of Independence, no… we do not believe that it’s ok to snuff out the life of a baby in or out of the womb. Some believe in certain circumstances, but Liberals always fail to see where abortion originated. The propaganda surrounding this area and the misinformation about the history of the subject has confounded the ability for liberals to think objectively and deduce opinions, based on real facts. Margaret Sanger – Planned Parenthood – Eugenics – African Americans – Abortion -> done and done. Look it up.
Another argument from the liberals, is that under regulation in the free market system has lead to the economic collapse of 2008. Then they go on to make fun of Bush, call him a Fascist, call me a Fascist and then say that Government regulations are needed to fix the problem. What? Fascism = bad to them, right? But they want Government control of private industry to prevent bad things from happening, right? So what’s Fascism again? Interesting argument…
Obviously, they’re wrong. Had they done the research, they’d know what caused the meltdown of 2008. What brought this failing economy was a failure of government oversight, via regulations on the mortgage market in the form of the 1977 Community Reinvestment Act, passed under Carter. That is to say, regulations lit the fuse to the dynamite 30yrs in the future. This Act was later fueled by Clinton by pressuring Fannie Mae to ease credit to aid mortgage lending, in 1999 (http://tinyurl.com/3jdn9e). This forced mortgage lending to those who couldn’t afford it, in what we now term as sub-prime loans.
It wasn’t Bush’s fault that the mortgage giants pushed these loans, but rather Clinton and the progressive Democrats in leadership positions. GW Bush actually tried to regulate Fannie & Freddie during his term, several times, to no avail (http://tinyurl.com/6lp5qu (2003) – http://tinyurl.com/5gvopc (2005)). Barney Frank continued to make claims that everything was fine and Fannie/Freddie were profitable corporations.
I’m not Bush’s biggest fan (I disliked many things he did, while liking many others), but it’s completely unfair to pin the collapse squarely on his shoulders, because in realityville, he had nothing to do with it. What he did do, however, was pass TARP… which, to me, was a huge mistake… but others would claim that our economy (along with the world’s) would have completely collapsed, beyond repair. Who knows… I’m not sure what I believe about that, but what I do know, is that overspending is not an option to take lightly. We’re in the position we’re in, right now, because of that lack of fiscal responsibility.
That’s another argument for another day, though. For this one, know that Socialism, Communism, Fascism and NAZIism all fall on the same side of the spectrum… the LEFT.
Reagan added ~$1,859,575,960,187.32 (in 8yrs – under Dem. Congress)
Bush 1 added ~$1,554,057,922,952.06 (in 4yrs – under Dem. Congress)
Clinton added ~$1,395,974,529,060.68 (in 8yrs – under Rep. Congress)
Bush 2 added ~$4,217,261,484,712.43 (in 8yrs – ~$2,125,246,249,523.44 under Rep. Congress – ~$2,092,015,235,188.99 under Dem. Congress)
Obama added ~$3,536,898,133,979.30 (in 2yrs – under Dem. Congress)
Source: US Department of the Treasury
The national debt has consistently increased since 1958. Prior to that, the debt fluctuated, but no one had truly worked to decrease the debt since Calvin Coolidge in the mid-late 20s.
The reason why tax cuts alone will not decrease the debt, is because there’s excessive government spending and expansion.
Cut taxes and you stimulate economic growth in the free enterprise system that is capitalism. More business equates to more revenue to the government from taxes – less business results in less revenue. It’s simple economics.
People are in business to make money, not lose it. Companies who overextend themselves will eventually go out of business, thus, they look for the best possible circumstance to conduct business. Business owners think in terms of being cost-effective. If moving elsewhere to avoid high taxes means they can stay in business, then that’s what they’ll do. If that happens, government in that district loses money – be it a city, state or nation. This should be common sense to most people.
Carter expanded government tremendously. This lead to higher taxes, which lead to economic collapse. Reagan pulled us out of that collapse at a much faster rate than Obama is right now. Reagan lowered taxes and realized that government was the problem – Obama added more regulations, more expansive government, and more taxes to come, due to new legislation and overspending, and is under the assumption that government is the solution. One method is working – the other isn’t.
Reagan’s method will bring us out of this recession – but we need to stop spending and decrease government, as well. That’s the only thing that will lower the debt. Right now, our social welfare programming is bleeding us dry.
What’s the answer? Cutting popular government programming? As a matter of fact, yes. Cut Social Security, Medicare & Medicaid, as well as the Department of Education, Environmental Protection Agency, Department of Homeland Security, the Internal Revenue Service, the Federal Reserve, federal funding to public radio/television and there are many others… The Department of Defense? Well, it could do with some shaving down… and we could certainly change course in several mission areas, but as of now, in the heated world that we live in, I wouldn’t cut.
The voters want low taxes… not higher spending – The government can’t help but spend, so they print & borrow. Despite what anyone in the Treasury might say… brace for inflation.
According to Gallup, the actual percentage of Americans collecting unemployment is at 10.1%, not 9.7%…
This means we’re .7% away from the peak level of unemployment in 1982, during the 80s recession oh behalf of Carter. Reagan was able to keep us from going into a depression, by instituting conservative measures to effect the economy positively. One of the effects was keeping unemployment in the 9-10% range from lasting longer than 1.5 years.
We’ve been holding an above 9% unemployment rate since May 2009, so it’s already been 1yr 4m. The Fed plans to throw more money into the system, creating inflation, the Bush Tax Cuts are being allowed to expire, resulting in one of the largest tax increases this country has ever seen, and the full effects of Obamacare haven’t set in yet, and won’t until about 2012. These policies… associated with an increasing debt & deficit, are going to keep these unemployment rates high… if not the highest since the Great Depression.
It’s hard to take arguments about the Federal Reserve being “necessary” in order to tackle monetary policy… otherwise, the people and otherwise free market wouldn’t be able to handle such difficult tasks as unemployment, inflation, etc, seriously.
It’s a wonder we were able to take care of business prior to 1913, for nearly 137 years. Now, for 97 years, we’ve been under the impression that the Federal Reserve is the be all/end all answer to all things economical. It’s funny that in the same year of the Federal Reserve Act, we were also slapped with the 16th Amendment, making income taxes permanent.
I would argue that both of these events were the first steps of the
progressive movement in government, taking control of the Free Market and keeping a steady income via taxes coming into the Treasury, in order to feed the troughs of pork bill spending and an increasing Congressional salary.
Funny that the Great Depression occurred after the formation of the Federal Reserve, when it was created to prevent such travesties. Even more interesting, is that we’ve had 19 recessions since the formation of the Fed out of 47 since 1797. So, 40% of our recessions (which includes the Depression of 1920-21, Great Depression of 1929-42, and current “Great Recession” of 2007-2010) have occurred, despite the Federal Reserve’s existence.
Now they want to shovel more money into the fire, in order to level things out… which will cause inflation… which will result in a less powerful USD and a decline in purchasing power, which will make things more difficult for Americans who are already underemployed, living on food stamps and looking toward an astronomical increase in taxes. Meanwhile, those people with jobs will continue to see prices for their everyday items rise, while their paycheck stays the same.
Can you see the trend, here? If their intent was to create another Great Depression… they’re off to a great start.
Sounds like a plan… thank you Obama, Congress & Fed.
Many people, especially liberals and those who are comfortable in watching the mainstream/biased news media, have no idea what the Tea Party is about, why it started up and who it’s comprised of, in addition to what it represents.
Instead of attending a Tea Party rally or having a conversation with a Tea Party Patriot, these uninformed citizens will parrot everything they’ve been told to think about the Tea Partiers (known as Teabaggers by the mainstream media & liberal elites), despite everything they hear being extremely biased, hateful and based purely on opinion of an idea that’s been implanted in their mind, since they’ve had no physical experience with the movement. Without questioning, they call us racists, bigots, stupid, ignorant, extremists, terrorists, astroturf, and bible-bangers, just to name a few.
I’ve been involved with the Tea Party movement for my own reasons since the beginning. I didn’t attend a rally until the first Tax Day on April 15, 2009, but I considered myself a Tea Partier and Tea Party Patriot as soon as the idea was realized nearing the end of February of that year.
As a Conservative, I had become fed up with government legislation as usual. I was watching our leaders throw our taxpayer money down the drain on frivolous things and my train of thought wasn’t being represented by the representatives that we voted into office. It was time to step up or shut up. I, along with millions of others, chose to step up… and we’re still standing to this day.
In the beginning…
Before the Tea Party, fiscally conservative Americans were getting upset with the spending spree that Government has been on since 2008 with taxpayer money. It was only around the end of 2008 where people started to wake up, as spending had been out of control for a while before then, but nothing like this – and the costs were not adding up simply due to the war.
People were getting fed up with the following:
A. Expanding, Big Government
B. Excessive & Irresponsible Spending:
the first stimulus package (which was passed by GW Bush and a liberal Congress had a large negative outcry and was ignored – cost: $168B)
TARP (which was passed by GW Bush and a liberal Congress – this had an enormous outcry, much like the Stimulus Bill that passed earlier in the year, and again the people, were not listened to – cost: $700B)
the Auto Bailout (passed by Obama and a liberal Congress – again, met with enormous outcry, like the previous bills before it… and ignored – cost: $81.8B
Homeowner Assistance Plan (again, met with opposition and ignored – cost: $275B)
Total costs, before the formation of the Tea Party: $1.224 Trillion ($1,224,800,000,000.00)
C. People were not being listened to by the government and mass media was misrepresenting the information that the people were receiving. If you tried to contact your representative in the Senate or House, you couldn’t get through, you’d receive a voice-mail message, or you’d talk to their assistant who would “take a message.”
The mainstream media ignored the dissent of the people and refused to question the administration about any of the ridiculous spending taking place.
D. The mainstream media was also not fully vetting Barack Obama as a viable candidate for the most powerful office in the world, as President of the United States. If not for conservative entertainment talk shows (on television & radio), we still wouldn’t know who he is. Even to this day, the mainstream media refuses to treat him like any other President… and they refuse to offer any tough questions during interviews or report facts to the citizens of this country. They haven’t been doing their job and they’ve shown obvious bias since 2007, prior to the 2008 elections.
The Tea Party started as a result of all of this, but not until Rick Santelli of CNBC actually ranted on live television about the astronomical spending of the Obama Administration, calling for a Tea Party. He was mocked by his colleagues and the liberal mainstream media, but his words were heard by the American populace, thanks to conservative radio/television and Fox News, who all reported on this.
About one week later in late February, Tea Party protests broke out across America on several different dates.
The first nationally organized party was April 15, tax day, 2009.
Looking at the above, it can easily be assessed as to why there’s been this uprising of American taxpayers. They’ve been taxed without representation for quite a long time, now, with no end in sight, their (our) voices unheard. The original Boston Tea Party was derived from the same reasoning. The colonists were not represented in government/legislation, but England continued to tax them, despite their numerous outcries prior to the movement which eventually lead to the Revolutionary War.
Constitution-Bound: One Nation, under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.
While the spending was running rampant, the debt was increasing to astronomical numbers that we couldn’t even conceive of ever paying back. Even though Obama promised to lower the federal budget and eliminate a deficit, the deficit continues to grow into even bigger numbers than we’d ever have thought possible. The deficit in 2008 under Bush was $700B, in 2009 under Obama it was $1.4T and in 2010, so far, it’s $1.3T. The government continues to borrow money from our political enemies (China), giving them more political power and creating a worthless USD. This borrowing and spending, and the addition of taxes is going to enslave generations of Americans to come for the foreseeable future, unless something is done here and now. President Bush was responsible for adding $2.5T to the national debt. Obama is expected to add $4.9T by 2016, just by the bills he’s passed thus far. This doesn’t include any spending down the pike that may or may not be coming.
It wasn’t until this had been talked about, that Americans had seriously started looking back to the Founders for help and guidance. People started reading and asking questions about the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution and the Federalist Papers. We started holding politicians accountable for their actions, by holding them to new and Constitutionally Conservative standards.
When we had a political foothold on the Hill (really only a few months after its’ beginnings), the Tea Party movement, that was built from fiscal conservatism and responsibility, began to call out the corruption in government, the lies and backdoor deals of politicians, the pork bills that were piggy-backing on bills that legislators weren’t reading, etc. It was then that we added social conservatism to our movement. Overtaxing and overspending is something to get angry about, but what fuels this in legislation? An ideology. Like certain news organizations and talk show hosts had warned, prior to the 2008 election, the people holding office were overwhelming Socialist in ideology… Obama and his friends were Marxists and they had/have a plan to “fundamentally change America” (his own words).
This isn’t the America we grew up with… the preceding generations didn’t grow up with a laissez faire attitude, they didn’t expect the government to take care of their every need and didn’t expect anything for nothing. They believed in working hard, doing your best, God and thanking God for what you have, America and the beacon of light it was for freedom, and they had strong, conservative family values. This current administration, unlike the previous, is trying to undermine these conservative values. They truly are fundamentally changing America and the American dream. They’re taking over/nationalizing/socializing private industries, left and right, continuing to spend our children and grandchildren into debt & slavery, taking God out of politics and public life, belittling American citizens, undermining the Constitution, replacing it with case law, ignoring the needs of States and acknowledging State’s Rights, they’re no longer defending the borders and preventing illegal immigration, they’re depleting our national security and defenses, and they’re throwing our international allies under the bus. Americans have had enough…
So while the Tea Party is comprised of people of all colors, ethnicities, religions and political affiliations, it’s truly a Conservative movement… because we want the government to be accountable. We want the Constitution to matter, the Declaration of Independence to matter… and we want all people, in government and out, to be held responsible for their actions, equally. We want everyone to be treated equally, but not provided for equally. We all believe in working for what we have, making our own way, smaller and less-instrusive government… we believe in charity for our fellow man, not regulated by our government, but regulated by ourselves. We believe in John Adam’s Capitalism/Free Market values, which allowed this country to become the most prosperous in the world, to have ever existed. We believe in God, for without which, we have no inalienable rights provided to us by a higher power – thus making Government the highest form of power that we answer to.
Tea Party Patriots believe in so many of the same things, but joined for so many different reasons, it’s difficult to define the term. That’s why I could write this post forever… Not everything that I stand for, is everything that someone else stands for. There are Democrats, Republicans, Independents, Christians, Muslims, Jews, white people, black people, etc. in this movement. We’re all different, but we are united. We’re unhyphenated Americans who are Constitutionally-bound. We want to be heard, we want Representation, we want our liberties and smaller government, we want corruption the Hell out of OUR government and we certainly damn well better get the TRUTH.
Today, after donating to the Arizona Governor’s Legal Defense Fund to fight the Federal Government’s attack on common sense and Constitutional law, I felt it necessary to send some words of support and encouragement to Governor Jan Brewer. In a time where Federal Government is doing anything it can to bypass the Constitution in order to gain votes and ram its’ policies down our throats, it’s very rare to find someone in the public eye (especially a state government official) who has the courage to stand up to such a politically corrupt and powerful regime, like the Obama administration… which has no problem throwing money around.
To Governor Brewers actions, I had this to say:
Topic: Thank You For Standing Firm
Good afternoon Governor Brewer,
I just wanted to stop in via E-Mail to thank you for the wonderful work you’re doing for your state of Arizona, as well as the nation, as a whole. The United States has needed someone of strength and perseverance for the past several years (possibly decades) to stand up for the American people’s unalienable rights to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness… all of which are threatened under the laissez faire approach of the Federal Government to enforce immigration policies/laws, especially under the 14th Amendment of the Constitution.
It’s absolutely atrocious, how the Constitution has been ignored, neglected, misinterpreted and misconstrued by educators, lawyers, judges and government officials. I know that with people like you and finally, the rebirth of a self-educated America (thanks in part to those in Conservative talk radio and those on the Fox News Network), we can take this country back in the direction it should be headed – back to our founding principles and values, passed on to us through our Founding Fathers, the Declaration of Independence, U.S. Constitution and basic Judeo-Christian morals/ethics.
Thank God for you, Governor Brewer. The American people are behind you and will stand side-by-side with you to fight for our rights and our Republic. This nation is built on laws and we, all of us, must abide by them. Illegal immigrants (aliens) are just that… illegal.
Thank you so much for your time and God bless,
Kevin Bush
kevin@polidiotic.com
609-892-7551
PS – I certainly do hope to visit AZ as soon as my wife and I have the opportunity. =]
PPS – As an aside, please search MSNBC’s website to find the current poll about the new AZ law. After about 3 million votes, 96% of those who voted stand with you. Of course, there isn’t a way of preventing someone from voting more than once… but 3 million votes is quite a lot. At least 60-70% of America is with you… and I would guess many more percentage points than that.
I encourage anyone who reads this and that has been paying attention to the ongoing corruption in the Federal Government over the last two years to lend a helping hand to Governor Brewer. She needs our help. Alone, she has a great voice, but together, we form a very loud and powerful civil army. We need to fight amnesty and we need to fight for and protect our unalienable (defined by the Declaration of Independence) and Constitutional rights. Donate as much money as you can possibly afford. I’m sure any amount is a lot, especially in this time of recession and high rate of unemployment, but winning this battle will set a new standard in this nation. Illegal immigration will finally be dealt with, more states will rise to the occasion to protect their own borders with similar laws (just as they are now), and those states with sanctuary policies will be dealt with.
If you can’t send money, at least send some words of encouragement and support. You can do so here.
God bless Governor Brewer, the people of Arizona and the United States!
How many times are we going to see this from black communities? Why is it that anytime there’s a criminal case that ends in a resolution that they find “unfair,” they have to riot and destroy their community? It’s absurd… and their community leaders should speak up and denounce this ridiculous activity.
Meanwhile, Holder and crew are reviewing the case to see whether or not it merits federal prosecution? What happened to “…the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed…”? Oh, right… this current administration doesn’t believe in the Constitution. Just strike the 6th Amendment out of the book, along with the 1st and 2nd. They’re no longer valid.
The following may be unsuitable for the rational… It may even frighten those who live in reality… and I cannot be held accountable for any resulting hemorrhages or seizures you might experience… For you are about to enter: THE CONSPIRACY ZONE!!! DUN-DUN-DUNNNN
The Conspiracy Zone is like no other place in the Universe… because it exists outside of reality, rational thinking and reason. Waterfalls flow up, wood is made out of cloned red cats, with laser eyes, and cheese is made out of milk. =/ Prepare yourself for an adventure unlike any other, because this ride is wild… this is one rollercoaster of an emotion tube, just ready to rupture. And yes, “emotion tubes” exist in THE CONSPIRACY ZONE!!!
Read on, fair thinker, and witness the winding road from Fox News to Global Warming to Suadi Kings to 9/11, to Pearl Harbor and beyond!
(This conversation is taken from Facebook…)
Bishop R Taylor: Fox news!!! This is a slap in the face to all who support this hypocrite! Carbon is not a pollutant! Fox is owned by this scum sucking moron! This pisses me off in a big way! I have never read the huffington post before. Fox is going green??? It makes sense with the names of the people like Neil Cavuto in green and som…e of the Fox new sysmbols are now green! So many people trust Fox news and this is a kick in the face! How can anyone trust Fox News? News Corp Aims To Go Carbon Neutral While Fox News Promotes Climate Change As A Hoax www.huffingtonpost.com – Special From Mother Jones By Kate Sheppard
(Vedamony Titus, Maureen Coddington, Ernest Dobbs and 3 others like this.)
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Rupert Murdoch thinks in dollar signs $$$$$$$, that’s the bottom line. Don’t be too quick to throw the baby out with the bath water and trash Fox News because Murdoch was “somehow coaxed/influenced/persuaded” to take global warming somewhat serious. All the guy cares about is RATINGS and $$$$$$$$. Murdoch does not speak for Greta Van Susteren, Sean Hannity, Neal Cavuto, O’Reilly or any of the rest of the newscasters and show hosts. SMELLS to me like Murdoch got bought off.
Rick Morgan: you cannot trust anyone blindly !
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Oh, and by the way, Murdoch going green DOES NOT make me MISTRUST Fox News in the least. They’re still the most reliable source of news on the air!
Troy Sutton: If in fact the elitist was to make the planet Carbon Neutral, they would have to destroy the whole thing. Scientist have long know that almost everthing on, in the planet is carbon based… So the world is going to destroy itself… LOL Leave the Climate alone, it have always self corrected… That’s what it does… You can change it, you can only make it worse. Think about it it was created from God( (formed for the PC crowd) and evolved into it’s current state fropm a molten ball, with out the help of man for millions of years. Now if man who thinks he better than God messes with it the way they have for the past 200 years man will upset the ballence God (Giai) has set into place… The Climate Change elite don’t even trust their own god avatar.
TJoseph Yoakum: Trust only God.
Save Our Constitution: Satan works in partial truths. Fox is merely the deception arm of the same world elitists. You cannot believe anything they say without vetting it out yourself. If you are not willing to research and verify all that the main scream media feeds you, you should find another hobby instead of watching the boob tube trash or listening to radio commentary and news!!!!
Louise Loftis: What part of “FAIR AND BALANCED” DON’T YOU UNDERSTAND????????
Save Our Constitution: LOTFALMAO – “fair and balanced” – hohohohoho. What a joke. And that joke is on the boobs who suck it all in!!! HAHAHAHA. I needed a good laugh this morning – thanks.
Louise Loftis: I am truly beginning to think you are working against the Contitution… FOX IS FAIR AND BALANCED…THEY ARE NOT THE LIB MEDIA, THEY SHOW BOTH SIDES…IF THEY WERE SO BAD THEY WOULD NEVER ALLOW PEOPLE LIKE GLENN BECK ON THERE. YOU ARE THE ONE WHO IS LAUGHABLE. I CAN TAKE WHAT THEY SAY WITH A GRAIN…I CAN LISTEN TO BOTH SIDES WITHOUT BEING “TAKEN IN” YOU ARE VERY CRITICAL AND WRONG TO JUDGE THEM ON THE THINGS YOU DON’T AGREE WITH…TAKE THE GOOD FROM IT…GO WITH THAT…IF YOU ARE SO SMART IN WORLD AFFAIRS YOU CAN EASILY DISAGREE, BUT DON’T DISCREDIT THEM.
Randy Breece: bravo louise!
Bishop R Taylor: Louise you must rely on FOX for everything?Fox news is not the constitution! If you support the consitution you would realize that a news media is not your friend. Fox is nothing. so if you take your own advice and stop thinking of a News media as the constitution and in your opinion working against the constitution? I am a Patriot and I support and defend the constitution from all enemies and operation mockingbird that CNN. MSNBC, and of course FOX news participates. This is nothing new! FOX news is not the truth! Why did they not ask how and where did the H1N1 come from? This is one story that no one covered? I put the truth up on my wall! If you want to live in FOXland and believe they are the absolute truth then do it? My Patriotism is not in question! I am not going thru life with Fox news blinders on! Glenn Beck is a very good advocate for Liberty. Hannity is OK. It is all spin and should be looked at and investigated not simply take for fact! Glenn Beck even tells you to question with boldness! You defending Fox news does not make you a patriot! It makes you a follower and not a doer. I investigate and use my brain and follow up and do my best to give the facts.
Our problem is we believe everything that a news media tells us?
Kevin Bush: Fox News is always under attack… it’s getting tiring.
FOX has already gone green – they were reporting that during 24 last year, if anyone remembers. It made me sick and Glenn Beck actually spoke about it, gagging as he did.
Because Murdoch feels that “going green” is in the best interest (which is just ridiculous, if you ask me) of his corporation, it has nothing to do with the messages from the various hosts, such as O’Reilly, Hannity or Beck. I also love the argument where people claim that those three are acting on behalf of the Saudis… *blegh*
Save Our Constitution: Sorry, I didn’t mean to tweak your nose – I automatically assumed that anyone with access to the net has researched this and vetted out those liers. Silly me.
Your reference to our constitution is a bit frightening. Our founding fathers were very critical about who they trusted and what that trust meant to future generations.
There is an abundance of info that you can view by merely googling a word or phrase. Of course, you will need to decide for yourself what you ultimately believe. But, its all there and it’s YOUR choice. As for me, I will put my faith only in GOD. All others need to prove without a shadow of a doubt before I even begin to trust.
Bishop R Taylor: I think that Fox is the best we got! I also know we can do better! Glenn Beck is a nice guy! I agree with Beck on most issues and I have put up over 10 websites and also understand the CFR is responsible for disecting the news and sending it out over the AP where all media gets its news!
It is our duty too question all! It is not an option to support and defend FOX news??? It is like using your brain is a crime?
Listen is the owner goes green then remember that green is the new RED! We do not need green energy! It is garbage!
The screwball enviromentalist are scum! I do not support it!
It is a global tax paid to a world government! When did news become entertainment?
Bishop R Taylor: Fair and balanced? So what! If they only report what the Council on foreign relations allows them? I cannot believe the zeal for FOX? Maybe is you had that zeal for your Liberty then the country would be in better shape?
Randy Breece: i think we all can do better at being zealous for liberty but remember it is not good to have zeal without knowledge nor be hasty and miss the way!
Louise Loftis: My Faith is in God, that is a definate…and I pray each day for wisdom. I do keep up with the internet and all the so called truths out there. Deciding who to believe and who to take with a grain of salt. You are not 100% right and thinking you are must put you in some kind of elite status. I am a normal citizen who cares about defending the constitution and getting my country back to what it was when founded.
“A REPUBLIC” I don’t pretend to be someone I am not. I can only go on what God gives me, which is good instincts..You can dig and dig and find bad in everyone and everything. Start looking at the Good…don’t hate people…Love people> God works in mysterious ways as he is working in my life. I have said all I want to say on all of this. I stand by my rights as an American to feel as I do without you calling me stupid etc. I have done the work that you think is a requirement..But I do it with DISEARNMENT & for the love of Jesus. He will guide me when I am right an when I am wrong.
Louise Loftis: And thank you Randy, seems I am truly outnumber in here.
Save Our Constitution: Remember also that the AP is owned by Reuters of London, which is owned by the Bank of London, which in turn is owned by the Rothschilds. Rochefeller and his ilk on Wall Street are quite “friendly” with them. For the last 100 years there has been NO separation in ideologies or intent, or even any competition between these two groups of thieves and murderers. They all gladly funded Margaret Sanger with her programs of depopulation through abortion, contraception, sterilization, etc. all over the world. They really consider it “their” world, and we are unfortunately trespassing. Africa is now a “ghost” continent since their involvement there, and Bill Gates and his kind has taken up the charge since Sanger died.
Murdock is mostly interested in money, but he belongs to the same secret clubs with the rest of those elitists, so he will accept their agendas because it suits his purpose. Beck, Bill O’, Hannity, etc. are being paid a VERY handsome sum for their “loyalty”. The level of deception goes SO deep that it is impractical and foolish to put your trust in any human being or human endeavor. All of this info is readily available to anyone interested. However, I suspect most folks would rather not upset their comfortably secure little world. I say: Good luck and God Bless!!!
Kevin Bush: Bishop, I think questioning everything is great and necessary… but we should support that media which is most honest and least biased, so that others might follow suit. Show support with your $ and your attention, just like you would any other consumer product. That’s what’s great about capitalism – the people can change the environment through their support, by producing a competitive market.
I hate the idea of going green as much as the next guy, and I think it’s a travesty, but that’s their decision… just like the many liberal idiots that I know, who bought hybrid cars, smart cars & wish for solar/wind power. Good God, it makes me insane…
Can you imagine what the people at FOX think about this, though? Especially Hannity & Beck, who know this is a farce… and they’ll have to deal with “green” lighting, etc. Like working in any building or working for any company, the employee/renter doesn’t have a say in the matter and just have to deal with it.
I don’t know how we’d boycott this green move, without boycotting Fox News altogether… but I’d send letters, I suppose, of discontent. Maybe they’ll listen. Send them to HQ & Murdoch, not the front men. I’ll continue, however, to support the reporters/journalists/hosts on FOX News, because whether they’re working in a green environment or not, the message is still 99% more factual/honest than that of the competition.
Louise Loftis: Well said Kevin.
Save Our Constitution: If you really want to help your country, turn off all network news – including Fox and only watch local news. There are plenty of internet sites that post the important issues also. Don’t continue to support the international thieves – they own the networks and are the ones who are destroying our country through deception. We’re losing our freedoms on a daily basis through the apathy of our citizens and trust in politicians and celebrities. They are only human and therefore fallen. When a politician errors – through greed or ignorance, we pay for it. The same goes for celebrities. They are not as informed as they would like you to believe. It’s a game of deception much like directors and actors in a movie. The more folks they can convince, the more it benefits them both in status with their owners (the elitists) and in $$.
And if you really want to learn what is happening in the world today, read everything you can on our nation’s history and all that others have written about historical events and people. Remember, human nature never changes – it’s been the same since Adam. Because of free will, every human is capable of evil and errors. I don’t trust Fox because it is owned by an elitist NWO member, because it’s a world corporation and because they have lied and erred on TOOOO many occasions for it to be coincidence.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: LMAO@Save Our Constitution – I see… you don’t trust Fox News… but you do trust GOOGLE!!! ROTFLMAO!!! THANKS FOR THE BELLY LAUGH!! THAT’S THE FUNNIEST THING I’VE HEARD ALL DAY!!! (A little hint for ya fella: Research WHO’S pulling GOOGLE’S STRINGS!) duh!
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Kudos to Louise and Kevin!!!
Save Our Constitution: What???? You folks are putting me on, right. You’re can’t be this uninformed. Here’s a News flash: Google is merely a SEARCH ENGINE – not a vetting site. If you don’t like Google, use another engine….. God help us!!! How do you vote…. eeny, meeny, miney, moe??? Or do you simply ask Beck how to vote??
If we are to have any hope for this nation we will need to “get some learin'” – know what I mean? Read, read, read – and pray for WISDOM!!!!!!!!!! Lord have mercy.
Kerman Carr: I am curious to know if those of you who support Fox News, think that 9/11 was an inside job?
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Kerman: I was leary about it being an inside job at first blush when the conspiracy theories began coming out. But more and more, as I’ve read articles and watched very convincing videos (NYC Firemen speaking out) I have been awakened to the very real possibility that 9/11 was far more than just a “foreign terrorist attack”. In particular, the IMPLOSION of Tower No. 7 – indeed “A Smoking Gun”. I am continuing to follow information as it is released. Mind boggling and deep disturbing.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Wake up and smell the coffee S.O.C; Google TRACKS AND RECORDS everything you search! (They’re in BIG BROTHER’S hip pocked in that respect.) The ONLY SECURE “search engine” is SMARTPAGE, which is the ONLY way I do any web surfing! Not Bling, Not Google… smartpage.com/eng
Check it out!
Kimberly Ann Baehr: PS) S.O.C. – sorry, forgot to add READ READ READ! LOL
Louise Loftis: NO to SOC on turning off Fox. NO to 9/ll conspiracy that the building was imploded…poopyrock crap…Do you even know how many lifes would have been lost in the process of getting the building ready for such an event, it takes hours of Openly planting the TNT explosives or whatever else the use…days getting it right…openly seen explosives coming in and out of a building up elevators…I could go on all day with this one..crap talk…..you are out of your minds…talk to the experts about implosion and how it works…you with all the knowledge. As far as my Country…no I do not believe that they knowingly let that happen…maybe some idiots that had connection let it happen, while we slept or President at that time not keeping a tight rein on things..This is not my expertise I admit…but Common Sense Rules here.
Kerman Carr: Kimberly – thanks for your response. I just went to smartpage and it went to AT&T’s website. Did I miss something?
Save Our Constitution: Touche, Kim, but the issue was being informed. So, you are paying attention? That’s good. Just do yourself a favor and relegate Beck and Co. to the trash bin and get your learnin’ from other than MSM sources – they mush of your brain like Mad Cows disease.
AHHH, the smell of coffee!! Thanks, think I’ll get some right now.
Kim Kreider Muhlenfeld: Careful on what you read on the Ultra Liberal Huffington post, Liberals will do anything, and I mean anything to discredit a conservative. So consider the source before you take a stand.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: My smartpage search engine does not go to AT&T. Don’t know what else to tell you, but their home page (where the download is) has a video telling you all about thier PRIVACY assurance… unique to any and all search engines out there today. If you googled “smartpage”… well maybe that’s the problem? Google doesn’t want to lose it’s customers! Try again… http://www.smartpage.com/eng/
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Louise – you sound a lot like me before I watched a video of a Press Conference of the NYC Firefighters’ organization to seek the truth about 9/11. You are absolutely correct – a building cannot IMPLODE on it’s own – and building No. 7 was never hit by a plane or fall debris from the twin towers, yet there is actual footage of it IMPLODING – just the way a building implodes when a demolition crew brings down a building. If I hadn’t seen it with my own eyes, I couldn’t have believed it. I’ll get you the name of the NYC Firefighter’s org and the addy of thier press conference video. It is extremely disturbing and eye opening. Do I want to believe our own government was complicit? ABSOLUTELY NOT!!! But I have researched and seen very convincing evidence. Have you done any research?
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Kerman… just try putting in http:www.smartpage.com (leave off the /eng/ … see if that works for you.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: http://www.smartpage.com (sorry, I left out the 2 back slashes)
Save Our Constitution: Louise & Kerman, for me the jury is still out an any and all terrorist attacks. There is WAAAY too much evidence of complicity by certain elements of our gov. to make a rational decision one way or the other. Additionally, with the MSM owned by the corporate elitists, and as time progresses, the evidence piles up on the side of complicity.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: I agree with you Kim Kreider Muhlenfeld – the Huffington Post is the last place to go for trustworthy information!
Save Our Constitution: Hey KIm, have you seen this vid??
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KpLNlSKugHw
Food for thought.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Good for you S.O.C.! I’m enjoying my cup o’ joe right now, too! 🙂 BTW – I never listen to the LAME STREAM MEDIA.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: S.O.C. – haven’t seen that exact video – but I already posted some time ago the fact that Facebook was in the “monitoring” business. I posted to warn FB users. You can find it on one of my older posts.
Kevin Bush: *slams head into wall*
What in the world does watching Fox News (which I do) have anything to do with being a 9/11 Truther (of which I’m not)?
It’s so freaking absurd to think 9/11 was an inside job for more reasons than Louise gave… Take physics into account, for one, and go read: Physics for Future Presidents. The first chapter outlines the physics that occurred with the planes hitting the Twin Towers and the after events.
Ok, now that we’re up to speed on the physics, let’s talk about the continuous terrorist threats and attempts we’ve seen before and after 9/11. Then let’s take a look at a group of people, who we’re fighting right now, who will intentionally strap bombs to women and children and send them after civilians and soldiers, so long as it suits their purpose. Then, maybe we can look at the video tapes of Osama bin Laden, where he mentions his terrorist threats, warnings & admission. He’s been a terrorist for far longer than 9/11/01, and he’s been on the FBI Most Wanted List for almost as long.
How can anyone, in good conscience, believe that this was an inside job? If it is, what’s the motivation? Who was the scheming grand master? I’m curious to see who’s behind all of this.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: LOL@ Kevin – stop slamming your head into the wall, lol. Gimme a few to locate the NYC Firefighters Press Conference video… and I’ll post it. Then you can watch and make up your own mind. This is all coming from a BIG TIME SKEPTIC OF A 9/11 CONSPIRACY. And you got me on WHO would be behind such a scheme… lots and lots of unanswered and unresearched questions. Back when I get the pertinent links.
Kerman Carr: WOW! This is soooo scary!!! I just clicked on your link and I got this:
Invalid URL
The requested URL “/”, is invalid.
Reference #9.84a31645.1272306239.3b0eda8
Someone please tell me that this happened to you too!
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Kevin and Louise… here’s a place for you to begin if you so desire… http://firefightersfor911truth.org – still looking for their Press Conference video link.
Ryan Sieben: trust only god lol, what has god told you that you can trust?
cause he has sure never said anything to me lol
Kimberly Ann Baehr: In case the link doesn’t work… I just posted it to the main FB News Feed.
Save Our Constitution: Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda were created by the c-i-a back in the late ’70’s when they needed to stir up trouble with the Soviets. It worked, so when they needed another “operative” in the mid-east, they used him – and his name after he died – to accomplish their latest endeavor. He was on their payroll until he died. The deception is SO deep. Lets hope the sheeple wake up soon.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: The NYC Firefighters organization’s PRESS CONFERENCE, that is.
Save Our Constitution: Ryan, He speaks to all of us if we are “inclined” to listen.
Kimberly Ann Baehr: Okay – found it! Here’s the YouTube link: The title of the video is “FireFighters for 911 Truth.org – Finally”. Listen and decide for yourselves. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kxGB2YoGV-I
Kimberly Ann Baehr: To Ryan: how do you expect God to speak to you? When was the last time you cracked open a Bible and read what He has to say? That’s the only means whereby God can speak to the hearts of men via the Holy Spirit.
Kerman Carr: Kimberly and everyone – you may want to check this out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y59d83WwNXI
There is a 6 part series from Alex Jones actually picking that video segment apart and analyzing it, which is pretty good depending on how you feel about Alex Jones. That is here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGEo6knbYLc&feature=related Check out all 6 vids to get to that part. It’s all pretty
By the way, I am neither here nor there. I don’t even have cable and just found out who Glen Beck was a few months ago, but I think these videos are very revealing. So, I guess that kinda makes me there. Anyway, enjoy!
Louise Loftis: Already been there Kim…you made me look, as at least you were polite about it..I Believe those Firefighters, but how was it possible..It had to take years to make this come together like it did…Where was Clinton in all t his?????
Kevin Bush: Oh my dear God in Heaven, why have you forsaken me with endless drivel about the same old things that make absolutely no sense and contain ridiculous testimonies of those who are not trained or educated in the matters of which we speak?!$!?$!!?
Ok, sorry about that… *ahem*
So now Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda were created by the United States… Ahha…
I’ll concede you one point: We armed Afghanistan to fend off invasion from the Soviet Union, because we wanted to aid in protecting further countries from having to undergo tyrannical communism, which was the scurvy of the Western World.
What the Americans didn’t know at the time, was that Al Qaeda was committing atrocious terrorist attacks on Soviet soil for years. Since the Soviets were sheathed by their iron curtain, the Western World didn’t have the knowledge they do know, which was that they were defending their borders… not that that makes them the good guys, by any means. What it looked like, to us, was that the Soviets were attempting an invasion. So, what did we do? Sent Afghanistan weapons to protect themselves.
Point conceded…
However, we did not “create” Al Qaeda, the Taliban, or any other radical Islam group. They and the other radical Islam terrorist factions have been around since the 80s, but radical Islam has been in existence for ages. Afghanistan, Iraq, Iran, Sudan, Palestine, etc… have tormented their own people and their neighbors and have attempted to invade European & Christian cultures/nations for decades, if not the last century or two… if we want to go way back. Hell, even the Founding Fathers noted the Muslim terrorists in their writings.
Wait… that must mean they’ve been in on this since the beginning. Yep, you’re right. TJ set us up 200yrs ago. Then, about 170yrs later, the CIA used Bin Laden in their grand schemes to create videos 20+ years in advance (no wonder the videos look so fuzzy), to tell of the coming disasters… but make it seem like they’re GOING to happen or have Bin Laden just stake claims… because he’s going to be dead anyway… people will just blame him, etc, and we’ll just act like he’s living in caves somewhere and we can’t find him. Done and done. Then we can wreak havoc on the world… gaining nothing in return. Sounds like a plan worthy of the great Roman Empire… speaking of which, didn’t the Founding Fathers study Cicero? This just gets deeper and deeper…
Save Our Constitution: Louise: Bush and Clinton were mere figureheads. The powers that have been behind our presidents for at least the last 1/2 century (I’m not old enough to go back any further) are the real criminals. They don’t just own our politicians, they own us. Reagan may have been patriotic initially, but he was shot at early on. IMHO, he capitulated to their control after that very serious threat. The evidence is in his fiscal irresponsibility when he TRIPLED our debt in 8 years!!! We have not had a “real” president since Ike & JFK – and we saw what happened to him.
Save Our Constitution: Kevin: you’re right on the Verge of believing all of this insanity aren’t you? All you’ll need is just a little more info – keep digging, you’re almost there.
Save Our Constitution: Kim: that’s an awesome vid of the NYC firefighter. Thanks, I’m sharing.
Kevin Bush: Woops, I mentioned “Al Qaeda” was committing atrocious attacks, etc… but I meant “Afghanistan.” Al Qaeda didn’t come until later.
Kevin Bush: lol SoC, you’ll never get me, unless you can prove, beyond a shadow of a doubt, that what you’re claiming is 100% true. =]
Save Our Constitution: Kevin, no one had to prove anything to me – I came to my own conclusions after ~ 2 years of research. However, my journey really began about 20 years ago when I got involved with the pro-life movement and started to read about it’s beginnings. At that time I also was also getting deeper into my faith with a lot of Biblical reading and other faith info. I was teaching the faith to adolescents and it mandated much preparation.
I have never voted anyway but Republican. I viewed the Democrats as the party of Satan (which they are), but I now see that there is no redemption in the Republican camp either.
What I learned from my faith journey dovetailed perfectly with the political happenings. If you are open to God, He will grant you the Wisdom that no amount of education can give you. The best advice I can give you is to read and ask and then decide for yourself. Remember: None are as blind as those who WILL NOT see. In other words, you need to WANT to learn before you can sufficiently grow.
Peace and Blessings.
Kevin Bush: SoC, there’s no proof… You’re only going on what ifs, suppositions, assumptions and leads that lead nowhere, hearsay and unconfirmed “facts.”
conspiracy theory (noun):
1. a theory that explains an event as being the result of a plot by a covert group or organization; a belief that a particular unexplained event was caused by such a group.
2. the idea that many important political events or economic and social trends are the products of secret plots that are largely unknown to the general public.
Kerman Carr: SOC – Well said.
Kevin – while I can understand that you would like additional proof, can you accept the fact that what was officially reported is a lie from our government?
Kevin Bush: Anything can be a lie, Kerman.. we’re being lied to daily by this current administration.
Save Our Constitution: Kevin, did you watch the video that Kim just posted.
If you did, you should have some questions like anyone would have right? I mean, that speaker knows a good deal about fire investigation, wouldn’t you say? So, why was it not done according to the code????? Bush, Giuliani, Clinton, the f-b-i, the c-i-a, the n-s-a: who will give us some reasonable answers – not the standard rhetorical b/s that the lying media pushes?
Kerman Carr: Thanks SOC, that was my next question. I also want to add that usually people lie because they want to cover up something. This should raise an eyebrow, if it doesn’t then I guess you’re just not a very curious person. No problem.
Chrystal Alspach: YEAH AND I WATCH O’REILY ALL THE TIME SUPPORTING SHITTING ALL OVER OUR CONSTITUTION!!THEY ARE SCUM !!
Kimberly Ann Baehr: ATTN: Kerman Carr: I made a TYPO when I gave you the link to the PRIVACY SECURE “search engine” I use instead of Google. The correct name of the search engine is START PAGE… NOT… SMART PAGE!!! (sigh, ugh)
Here is the correct link to download the search engine:
http://www.startpage.com/eng/
Sorry for the confusion… time to give the old fingers a rest for today! LOL
Kevin Bush: Kerman, I’m a very curious person by nature. In fact, I enjoy a little detective work… hell, I studied to become an Anthropologist, despite my not being one, professionally. ;P
I’m not irrational, however, which leads me to use reason, common-sense and available information and facts.
You ask me to watch your propaganda & truther videos, but you won’t read the chapter of the book that I mentioned? Why? I watched your video… and I saw nothing very revealing. Did you watch the planes fly into the WTC? Did you see the explosions? Did you see how the towers collapsed? These things are all very telling…
Knowing what happened, seeing the explosion and the way the buildings fell would… should tell you HOW the buildings fell. I’m sorry… have you ever seen a passenger plane fly into a skyscraper before? Have you ever seen a building that tall, fall without being prepped? Have you ever seen two fall, simultaneously… after TWO passenger planes exploded next to each other? Do you know how much fuel these planes require to fly? Do you realize how big they were? Is it really THAT surprising that an adjacent building might fall, because… oh, I don’t know… the other flaming buildings (the tallest buildings in the city) sitting next to it just fell, uncontrollably? The heat… the explosions… the vibrations/earth shaking plummet of both buildings,containing massive amounts of concrete, steel, etc. falling to the ground?
Why is THAT so difficult to believe… but this conspiracy that the government was behind it and they’re out to get you, etc… is so believable? Ridiculous…
Maureen Coddington: Kevin, do you believe that Roosevelt knew ahead of time that Pearl Harbor was going to be attacked? Why were all of the carriers out to sea when it happened?
Kerman Carr: Kimberly – THANK YOU SO MUCH!!! That was driving me nuts! I finally got the yellow pages, but they’re soooo AT&T and I know they are sell outs. Thanks again.
Save Our Constitution: IT took 7 hours for blg. 7 to fall, and as the fireman said, the fires there were NOT of any consequence – certainly not large enough to cause it to collapse. In fact, there were people working in there right up until the time it was “pulled” as the policeman on the scene said: “They’re gonna pull it, get out of here”. Please watch the raw videos of that day, including the BBC video where the reporters announced blg. 7’s collapse 20 minutes before it did!!!! In addition, files from the big California energy corruption case were “lost” in blg. 7’s collapse!!!
And as for the tower 1&2, a jet fuel fire cannot melt steel – that’s a fact!!! The temperature can’t get high enough – and that’s with pure jet fuel. That fire was tainted with other combustibles that lowered it’s temp.
I don’t know what the real truth is. I only know that what the MSM and our gov. has given us is pure B/S. How can anyone with a reasoning mind not question this B/S???
Save Our Constitution: Maureen, I had a friend that was a sailor with the Pacific fleet during Pearl Harbor. He told me that story in 1967. He was there on one of those ships that were diverted to a small Island and told to wait further orders. It was Dec. 6th!!! They heard planes overhead but could not identify them.
Kevin Bush: Maureen, I’ve read the same things you have… Is there undeniable evidence supporting either view? No. Do I know if we received transmissions from Japanese ships, etc. Not sure… it’s possible. And not all carriers/battleships were out to sea… as is obvious from historical photos of sunk & damaged ships. Many, I’m certain, were out to sea, because that’s what carriers do… to be active, is to train.
SoC… read… the… physics… book… please. =] You ask for a well-rounded outlook on things, then read it.
Kerman Carr: Kevin – How do you know I won’t read the chapter? I never said that. I don’t even know what book you’re talking about. Care to re-post it? Perhaps I missed it.
I would love to hear your explanation about the Pentagon attack. How did such a giant plane do so little damage, leaving little trace of evidence?
Have you seen this? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Yx9NRX37SM&feature=related
Maureen Coddington: Kevin, Where does it say that you have to have “undeniable evidence” to make something true? The carriers were sent out to sea, or out of Pearl Harbor the day before. The Japanese spies reported them in the Harbor, which they were at the time, and then were sent out. The Japanese planes were already ordered to attack when the ships were confirmed in the harbor. Enough ships were left in the harbor to not arouse suspician that the Americans had broken the Japanese secret code. Will this ever be proved?Pprobably not. Radar had just been put into use and was untested at the time, which is why Hickam Field saw the blips on the radar screen and assumed they were returning American planes.
Save Our Constitution: Kevin, thank you for the book link. I read it and realized I’ve read before, but thanks anyway. It is as it states a very easily understood text because it is aimed at non-engineers – you know, folks like truthers who are generally dumb – right? However, I just happen to be an engineer, so it comes across as pedestrian to me, but I read it anyway.
The authors present a very compelling argument, but with a great deal of speculation. For instance: They assume the fire was hot enough to weaken the steel beams ro the point of collapse. That is speculation because they did not know the actual temp. and most likely did not attempt to duplicate that fire.
As the fireman in the video that Kimberly linked states: Without a proper and valid investigation according to the demands of the national fire code, no one can say for certain what actually brought down those 2 towers. Period!!!!! As for tower 7: It is without a ounce of doubt, th SMOKING GUN of the entire fiasco. Your gov. has been selling you b*llsh*t under the name of security for longer than I’ve been on this earth (I’m 67). I lost a very close friend in ‘Nam because of a lie (the bay of Ton-kin incident), and my brother was shot up jumping out of airplanes over Europe during a war that did NOT need to happen. Every war this nation has been involved in has been CONTRIVED – and by the SAME perpetrators – can you beat that!!! You really need to read historical events from the mouths of those who lived them, not the drivel fed in schools. Have a nice day, I’m done here.
Maureen Coddington: 6 Dec. – at 9:30 P.M FDR read the first 13 parts of the decoded Japanese diplomatic declaration of war and said “This means war.” What kind of President would do nothing? When he returned to his 34 dinner guests he said, “The war starts tomorrow.”
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/pearl/www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/pearl.html
Kevin Bush: SoC, don’t put words in my mouth… I never said that truthers were generally dumb, that’s you. I’m trying to have a decent discussion, based on common sense, reason and things I’ve read. I mentioned the book, because it has a direct correlation to what we’re talking about… and is a scientific book about physics. I didn’t link it, btw… so hopefully you’re looking at the correct one. There are two books of the same name. One’s a text book for college kids.
Regardless, I didn’t know you were an engineer… kind of interesting that you mention that now. Ok, so the evidence of the explosion/fire being forceful enough and hot enough to create the kind of chaos that occurred is speculative. And your conspiracy theory isn’t speculative?
Yeah… get information from people in the field right? So, basically like you? That’s great… we can all educate our children so that we’re all conspiracy theorists. Enjoy your life, friend… Keep being paranoid, because you know… they’re all going to get you in the end. ;]
Kerman, I’ve seen that video… I’ll let Maddox take this:
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=911_morons
Maureen =/ Do you see where you’re getting your information? From a site called “Whatreallyhappened.com” Doesn’t that just scream conspiracy theory to you? And what’s with the geocities.com link? Is that an archived page, saved by WRH? Ridiculous… balderdash… ludicrous…
See that Maddox site? It’s ridiculous, right? So ridiculous that it makes complete sense, kinda’ like all of this truther 9/11, pearl harbor crap.
Now here’s a conspiracy theory i can wrap my head around. ;]
I rest my case.
Is it any wonder why so many great and talented commentators/journalists leave the MSM for Fox News or other, more independent ventures?
Neil Cavuto (CNBC), Brenda Buttner (CNBC), Chris Wallace (ABC), Greta Van Susteren (CNN), Brit Hume (ABC) Chris Plante (CNN), Glenn Beck (CNN), John Stossel (ABC) and now… Lou Dobbs …(CNN)?
Funny how the majority of these people congregate toward a more objective news source, like Fox News, or other avenues, where the truth won’t be stifled. It’s also funny that most of these people were celebrated in the MSM for their editorial expertise or objective, world-class journalistic skills prior to joining FOX or taking to talk radio. All of a sudden, they’re not a reputable/reliable source of intel, because they tell you things you don’t want to hear… the truth.
Lou Dobbs, now that you’ve left CNN… welcome to freedom! I hope your voice rings louder and clearer than ever.
To see interviews regarding his leaving CNN or read/hear his point of view on politics, please visit him here: http://www.loudobbs.com
Again, it’s been quite a while since I’ve posted anything… since April, actually. There’s a reason for that. I’ve been very active on FaceBook in the political avenues available to me there. There are several political/patriotic/grassroots activism groups on FaceBook that I’ve become involved with and I continue to update the world on a daily basis, about what’s going on in the world, according to reality.
Battles are waged, wars are fought, and friends are won and lost in the world of political FaceBook. I urge you to join me in my efforts to spread patriotism and reality amongst those who would listen and those who are willing to open an eye. Come visit and engage in controversial conversation here: http://www.facebook.com/polidiotic